LOAN MODIFICATIONS: IS THIS WHAT I’M SUPPOSED TO BELIEVE??
IS THIS WHAT I’M TO UNDERSTAND?
You don’t need to hire anyone to help you negotiate with your bank for a loan modification.
You don’t need an attorney, you don’t need a mortgage expert, and you don’t need a fraud examiner.
All of those people, the lawyers, the mortgage experts, the fraud examiners… they’re all scammers because they CHARGE for their services.
And everyone knows that loan modifications are FREE… like water in a stream, or the air that we breathe.
Banks, on the other hand, have plenty of lawyers, mortgage experts, credit specialists, underwriters, and professional negotiators.
You, however, should come alone.
Who says you should come alone? The banks say so, that’s who.
The banks are looking out for you. The banks are going to help you. The banks are on your side. You can trust the banks.
The same banks that put you into mortgages where the payments double as soon as the prepayment penalty period ends.
The same banks that blame you, the borrowers, for the meltdown, and have already foreclosed on millions of homes.
The same banks that just lobbied congress to kill the bankruptcy reform bill that would have allowed judges to modify mortgages in bankruptcy so that people going bankrupt could have a chance to keep their homes.
The same banks that just lobbied congress asking for a top allowable interest rate of 500%, and got 390%, while they charge you 29% on your credit card.
The same banks that fraudulently packaged mortgage backed securities as AAA rated bonds and in doing so destroyed the bond market, and left the world’s financial systems in ruin.
The same banks that paid their executives untold billions in compensation and bonuses as the entire country was sliding into the deepest recession since the 1930s.
The same banks that have received TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS in taxpayer money. TRILLIONS.
Those same banks are now going to help you … as long as you come alone to the negotiation. Don’t hire anyone to help you… and they’ll help you.
And our President and our government agrees.
But the FACT is that banks are REQUIRED BY LAW to negotiate in the banks best interest, not yours. The law says that the bank MUST do what’s in the bank’s best interest, not yours.
It’s called a “fiduciary duty,” and it means that the banks MUST do what’s in the best interests of their shareholders, or their shareholders can SUE them for lots of money.
Those are the facts. And while you are entitled to your own opinion, you are not entitled to your own set of facts.
Here’s another fact: The banks don’t want you to have representation. They’d prefer you come alone… without help… without an attorney… without a mortgage expert. They’d much rather negotiate with people who are scared, emotional, and unknowledgeable. It makes it easier and better for them.
But the 5th and 14th Amendments to the United States Constitution state that:
No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.”
This can be viewed as a person’s rights to fair governing.
In the United States of America there are two types of due process of law, “procedural” and “substantive”.
Procedural due process of law means that the procedures used by government in making, applying, interpreting, and enforcing laws be reasonable and consistent. Substantive due process of law means that the government cannot make laws that apply to situations in which the government has no business interfering. It means that the “substance” or purpose of laws be constitutional.
The Fourteenth Amendment continues and later talks about the “equal protection clause”. It states that no state may “deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.” The Fourteenth Amendment’s original purpose was to create a society in which all people were treated equally.
There have been three Taxpayer Bill of Rights passed by the United States Congress in the last 20 years. Here’s what the first right in the first Taxpayer Bill of Rights states:
Taxpayers have the right to legal representation similar to that of a criminal defendant. Taxpayers have the right to have the IRS processes explained to them. Taxpayers have the right to sue the government for damages caused by IRS officials.
Shouldn’t taxpayers have the same rights as homeowners when negotiating with their banks to avoid foreclosure and keep their homes?
How many scammers are there? No one knows. How many mortgages have been successfully modified with the help of a private sector law firm or mortgage firm? No one knows.
The government says we must protect homeowners from “scammers,” because homeowners can’t tell whether a given firm is a “scammer” or not. So, the banks and the government say they are all “scammers,” and you can tell because they charge a fee or retainer in advance of the work being completed… which is exactly the way all attorneys charge for every single case they take on.
Is it the scammers who cause the scam, or is it the homeowner who is in a panic? It’s the panic.
And who is causing the homeowner to be in a panic? Who defrauded the financial system and caused the housing meltdown and worst recession since The Great Depression? Who broke the bond market by selling bonds that were fraudulently packaged and sold to investors? Who put homeowners into loans they did not understand and could not afford?
The banks did all of that. The banks caused the panic. The panic leads to the scams.
SO, WHO ARE THE REAL SCAMMERS HERE?
Yes… that’s right.
SO, MAYBE IT’S TIME WE STOPPED LISTENING TO THEM. GET YOUR OWN REPRESENTATION BEFORE NEGOTIATING WITH YOUR BANK OVER A LOAN MODIFICATION. NO MATTER WHAT ANYONE TELLS YOU.
USE YOUR HEAD. THIS MESS WASN’T YOUR FAULT. POOR PEOPLE WHO WANTED HOMES DIDN’T CAUSE THE WORLD’S BANKING SYSTEM AND WALL ST. TO FAIL.
DON’T BE A SUCKER FOR THE BANKS… AGAIN.
In a related story…
Wells Fargo Bank killed a man recently. The man was in jeopardy of losing his home to foreclosure. He had raised his family there. He lived there with his wife. They lived in Agora, CA. He was trying to handle the negotiations himself. Because that’s what he was told to do…
The bank was refusing to work with him. They wouldn’t modify his loan. They told him he had to come up with tens of thousands of dollars or he’d have to get out. They were nasty with him. It was taking a toll on him. The stress must have been unbearable. He couldn’t stand the thought of losing what he had worked his entire life to protect.
Nothing worked. Now there was only ONE WEEK before his home would be sold in a foreclosure sale. He couldn’t stand it.
He had a massive heart attack.
He was 62 years old.
His widow buried him. She was scared that she would have to move from their home.
She hired the law firm of Serge, Rodnunsky & Jones in Woodland Hills. They called Wells Fargo and today they got the bank to agree to delay the sale until September. They’re confident they will be successful in obtaining a loan modification for the widow.
That’s all they needed… a loan modification.
But he is gone. Someone’s husband of decades. Someone’s father. Someone’s grandfather. A life ended.
Because the bank couldn’t modify the loan. A few dollars.
He worked his entire life in this country. His tax dollars made it possible for Wells Fargo to get bailed out by the government. And they killed him. And they didn’t and don’t care one bit.
And I will never forgive Wells Fargo or any of the banks for this. Never.
In all seriousness, do you remember this song?
You aint seen nothin yet! No no no no no no no no....Baby, you aint seen nothin yet.
Mandelman rocks!
I have been checking your blog on a daily basis since I "discovered" you. This is the best, well-put, frank & honest comment/blog I have ever come across and I can't help but put in my 2 cent worth of opinion. I can't add anymore to what you just have said today and before (checked your archives too!). Is it possible to buy a one whole page ad in the Los Angeles Times to spread this truth? I'm sure there will be more than enough money to cover this expense. What say you, honest, straightforward third parties, specifically lawyers out there?
When I first came across these 2 stupid bills (SB 94/AB764), I immediately thought of them as being unconstitutional and just plain stupid. I wondered what this group of insensitive, misinformed lawmakers were thinking? I agree that there are a bunch of scammers out there as I have become witness to their deceiving tactics but please, there are more honest people around too.
As somebody who has been actively assisting homeowners in their struggle to keep their homes, I cannot express any more than what has been talked about in your blog. Negotiating with a lender is a very time-consuming and tedious process. I currently do this on a daily basis and believe me, it has become a lifestyle and the money that comes with it (on a single file) is not even worth it. I can't put a price tag on the amount of effort that is being put in every case. My only consolation is knowing that I was able to assist a family in keeping their home through a reasonable loan modification.
I feel sorry for the widow from Agoura, CA. The husband need not die. That's just one story we have heard today. Wells Fargo is beyond despicable. Negotiating with them is not for the faint hearted. Just a little over 2 weeks ago, a Wells Fargo rep "initially" approve my client to stop foreclosure proceedings in exchange for an "initial" down payment and better hurry, cuz the "offer" is good for today only. I asked for time to consult with client and was nice enough to give me until the next morning. When I called back exactly the time agreed. Guess what? They couldn't "find" my authorization. Was I shocked to hear their incompetence and inconsistence? Of course not. I have learned to play these lenders games already. But for a homeowner, who's nervous, confused, harassed and intimidated, this is too much. I have realized that a homeowner in distress loses strength in the midst of a simple conversation with a rude, moronic $12.00/hour clerk (or should I say..."negotiator/specialist) on the other end of the line. That Wells Fargo clerk who caused this tragic event to happen to this family has blood on his/her hands.
I am sure there are more cases of this nature. So far, I have to deal with client/homeowners who pass their stresses to me. These people do not know what to do. I am blessed with over 20 years of real estate experience (as a neutral closing agent) and working now with an attorney who has a passion towards helping homeowners. We can only do so much but if these bills are passed, what more can we do. As more homes are getting foreclosed, what has the government accomplished?
Sorry for this long blog. I could go on and on but I guess I am just a small voice out there. YOU GO, MANDELMAN!!!! KEEP ON BRINGING IT ON!!!!
Be safe and well,
modarna
Everything you say on this subject is true.
If you are trying for a loan mod you MUST HIRE A ATTORNEY! PERIOD! or you will be wasting valuable time.
I use to work at one of the big banks, and I can tell you ALL OF US who worked there were instructed that if ever contacted by a law firm, the call was to directed to a different department.
Legal talks to legal. Its that simple. Banks don't need some massive lawsuit from a law firm, they have no fear of the "unrepresented" homeowner who has no clue about the game.
I was helping my mom with a loan mod and got 1 month of run around. Then I said mom, "time to hire a attorney." Interesting enough the paperwork given to us from the Law Firm, who is experienced in loan modifications, was DIFFERENT than the paper work given to us by the lender. Not by much, but is was CODED differently! Meaning, to me, that the bank/lender would know if the loan mod came from a regular homeowner or a law firm. Even the number to fax the papework to was different in the last four numbers.
The loan mod, which we were told by the lended could NEVER BE DONE BY THIS LENDER, has now been DONE!!! Case closed.
I think the Author seems to be just a tad too sensitive to be a lawyer.
We in the industry get the blame for the entire demise of the world economy. A couple of bad apples do not compare to the Wall Street and Bank Greed and Consumer greed of the past few years but we still get the blame.
LAWYERS are only good when they stop breathing. There are MORE than a couple of bad apple lawyers. The entire industry of lawyers suck and you guys rip EVERYONE off. You run around like dogs chasing not your tail but your own pocke to stick your hand into.
Gimme a break. The bank isn't going to do any worse to us without you than you are going to do to us with you.
Oh...and please don't give me the crap that you know more than us. LOL! You guys are dumb. You passed the bar? So what. I passed the CPA exam. I bet I'm more qualified to represent the borrower than you.
Nice Work!
I help people all the time with loan modifications. I am a certified mortgage planning specialist. As such, I understand the aspects of a good and bad mortgage and I understand the motivation of the Banks in "helping" the homeowner. LOL! They (Banks) have no motivation...
What I don't understand is how there are so many Lawyers who are now "loan modification" experts. When exactly did they start working in the Mortgage Business?
Notwithstanding, the best way to approach a loan modification is to get the bank to breach their fiduciary responsibilities.
Once again, Nice Work, Mandelman!!!!
Get real. Most of the people charging for modifications are ex mortgage brokers who put people into these crap loans in the first place. They should be providing the service for free since they didn't get the borrower a decent loan the first time around.
ANY ex broker charging twice (once for the initial crap loan and a second time to make it an un-crap loan) is a scammer in my book.
Well done. While I don't think that folks should go it alone, nor are banks watching out for Joe Homeowner, I am slightly amused at all the "Loan Modification Experts" that have popped up. I agree with a previous comment as well... many of the sharks in the loan mod business are the Hacks that couldn't make it in the mtg world.
At the end of the day - Joe Homeowner needs to rely on some of their own good prudence and research who they are looking at doing business with.
My motto in the Loan Mod World? Value before profit and only profit from value! Period.
Chris Brown [aka The Implementer]
If a bank has a "fiduciary duty" to protect its own interests (under the guise of its shareholders), then how in the h_ll are they going to protect the Borrower's interests - its a classic case of conflict of interest? the mortgage loan is a contract - who do you want to represent your interests in contract negotiations - the people you are negotiating with? Banks are pulling out all the stops to discredit and eliminate loan mod firms that represent the Borrowers. They lose 3rd party authorizations or, in the case of one response I just received today from Bank of America, they are [b]"unable to comply with your request for authorization to _______because the signature of the borrower on your request did not appear to match the signature on the original loan documents."[/b It is time to bring the President, his Administration and the Congress into the real deal world of loan modifications so they understand that the very taxpayers that bailed out the banks continue to be victimized by them day in and day out - it is patently UNCONSTITUTIONAL - as well as immoral, unethical and just plain evil.....[/i]
Banks have no fiduciary duty to the borrower. Courts have ruled on this many times. That said, with broker originated loans, liability can be assigned to banks in certain ways.
Most Mod Companies and attorneys don't have a clue about what they are doing. Just fill out the paperwork, file a rescission, and then hope for the best. It doesn't work that way.
First, it must be determined who has the authority to modify the loan, and what the PSA agreements say about modifications. Only then can a person accurately work on a mod.
I have been involved in this business for almost two years. I can talk with a person on the phone for 5 minutes and can tell who gets it and who does not. My own belief now is that without principal reduction, the mod means nothing. And the only way to get a true principal reduction is to use an attorney, and one that is willing to back up his requests with thee threat of litigation.
For those who think that TILA/RESPA audits are a good thing, think again. Lenders know that rescission is the only remedy with TILA and RESPA, and a loan in CA cannot be rescinded unless the borrower can tender a true offer paying bac the lender the money that is owed.
When you talk audits, you need someone who knows the law, the lenders, and has been in front of judges and attorneys and knows how to do an audit that an attorney can use for his complaint. If not that, it is a complete waste of money.
Let's stop being naive about who did what. Brokers (including real estate brokers) made a lot of money. But so did the banks AND so did some of their employees. Did we all forget that only a couple of years ago WAMU was investigated for encouraging appraisal reviews that always passed? The appraisal review firm was to either say yes to every appraisal or lose the WAMU account. I even have witnessed many bank underwriters making double or more their annual income with cash donations from brokers to approve loans. Lenders did not perform audits on files to make sure everything made sense and why should they have when in reality they were playing with other peoples money they were lending out (securitization was a marvelous invention by Lenders). And in reality, when you look through the fog, lenders are working on cutting out the brokers completely so they can take full control of the financing world. They need to shurn a profit and soon or else they loose market share and shareholders and shareholders lost means money lost. And why is it that it is everyone's fault but the person that took the loan? Are we saying that all borrowers are completely ignorant? Money was easy to obtain and it fullfilled all the things that we wanted, tv's, cars, travel. We all had a good time and the good time is over for the moment. It will come back again, greed will make sure of that.
Umm..casi:
Lenders are shutting out brokers because of the massive fraud, first payment defaults and the simple fact that...OMG...they don't NEED them!
The banks got along just fine without brokers up until the late 90's (when everything started getting stupid) , and they'll get along just fine without them once again.
And for the record no, I am not in banking.
You are absolutely right...
However, loan modifications make no sense either for many people as they are not in their best interest. Consider this analysis I did:
LOAN MODIFICATION OR WALK AWAY? The Business Case.
I decided to work a few numbers related to the walk away factor since this is starting to surge. As an example, consider the following:
Assume: Homeowner owes $400,000.00 on a home that is now worth $200,000.00. The loan of $400,000.00 has an interest rate of 6.5% The homeowner has reached out to their lender and is now offered a loan modification for an interest rate of 4.5%. This scenario achieves the following:
Current mortgage: $400,000.00 @ 6.5% = $2,528.27 per month.
Modified mortgage: $400,000.00 @ 4.5% = $2,026.74 per month.
Savings of ~$500.00 per month. On the surface, saving $500.00 per month sounds like a good deal, but is it?
Since the asset is worth only $200,000.00, consider the various interest rates for a term of 30 years:
6.5% rate gives a payment of $1,264.14.
8.5% rate gives a payment of $1,537.83.
12.0% rate gives a payment of $2,057.23, similar to modified payment proposed.
15% rate gives a payment of $2,528.89, similar to current mortgage payment.
In effect, the current lender is asking you pay a cash flow to them on an asset worth $200,000.00 with the modified loan at 12% or at the current monthly payment at 15%. This assumes that you pay your mortgage for a total of 30 years. Paying a mortgage at those rates makes no sense.
Accepting Loan Modification Cash Flow Analysis ($200,000.00 value):
30 years with a payment of $2,026.74 yielding 11.933% for a total of payments of $729,626.40.
30 years with a payoff at 10 years with a payment of $2,026.74 requires a $319,532.34 payoff yielding 14.933% for a total of payments of $562,741.14.
30 years with a payoff at 5 years with a payment of $2,026.74 requires a $363,972.30 payoff yielding 21.616% for a total of payments of $485,576.70.
This analysis is important. It would be rare that a consumer will actually go longer than 10 years with a modified loan and realistically it will end up being refinanced or the property sold somewhere between 5 to 10 years. That would mean the consumer will end up paying somewhere between 15% to almost 22%.
However, if the homeowner becomes a renter, consider this cash flow analysis:
Renting for various periods:
Renting for 10 years with rent for years 1-3 at $1,600.00 at years 4-6 at $1,750.00 at years 7-10 at $1,850.00 would be a total of payments of $213,000.00.
Renting for 5 years with rent for years 1-3 at $1,600.00 at years 4-5 at $1,750.00 would be a total of payments of $99,600.00.
Of course, none of this assumes any increase in value for the underlying property being owned nor any tax benefit. Any increase in value over the next 5-10 years is highly speculative and even a 5% increase per year still does not impact the 10 years projection in any real favorable ways. As consumers grasp this concept, the results could be dramatic.
Uhhm Matt Foley, I invite you to post examples of the horrible fraud that was committed by brokers? And I will advise you that before you do spend the time of thinking of these, the general broker community was never provided access to services such as Lexis Nexis. These were only available to the Lenders. Any kind of fraud checking software was available to only lenders. Appraisal reviews were compelted ONLY be lenders. Verification of income by filing IRS form 4506T was only done by lenders.
Anyway, you are on the wrong path if you feel sorry for what banks are going through right now. And by the way, things got stupid in the 90's because banks came up with 'securitization' to boost their profits. BROKERS DON'T LEND MONEY, BANKS LEND THE MONEY WHEN THEY APPROVE A LOAN. Why is this always ignored?
And they will grasp this concept. They will walk. It will be catastrophic if this is not dealt with quickly. Rising unemployment, rates and inflation will make this a certainty.
From a business standpoint it is ASSININE to try and hang on to your home when you are so far upside down.
Real estate values aren't everything, but I think we can all agree without it's stability there will be NO recovery.
Since our government and banks (same interests) have no intention of practicing mark to market accounting, take the hit, cut your losses and move on.
The banks would love nothing more than to shove all the blame onto the borrower. Banks have the resources to discern value of a property and they have the ability to nix any deal. If a bank lends an amount on a property, it is tantamount to an assertion by them that they would TAKE the property as payment FOR the property. If banks want to predicate repayment on amounts they assess as the value then jingle mail should constitute payment in full. If I give a home back to the bank in a condition similar to how I purchased it and the bank doesn't have to give me anything in return, how are THEY being shortchanged?
You aint seen nothin yet! No no no no no no no no....Baby, you aint seen nothin yet.
Yes, but I prefer:
You aint seen nothin yet! Yes, yes....Ba-ba-ba-banker, you just aint seen bankruptcy reform yet...
I have been checking your blog on a daily basis since I "discovered" you. This is the best, well-put, frank & honest comment/blog I have ever come across and I can't help but put in my 2 cent worth of opinion. I can't add anymore to what you just have said today and before (checked your archives too!). Is it possible to buy a one whole page ad in the Los Angeles Times to spread this truth? I'm sure there will be more than enough money to cover this expense. What say you, honest, straightforward third parties, specifically lawyers out there?
When I first came across these 2 stupid bills (SB 94/AB764), I immediately thought of them as being unconstitutional and just plain stupid. I wondered what this group of insensitive, misinformed lawmakers were thinking? I agree that there are a bunch of scammers out there as I have become witness to their deceiving tactics but please, there are more honest people around too.
As somebody who has been actively assisting homeowners in their struggle to keep their homes, I cannot express any more than what has been talked about in your blog. Negotiating with a lender is a very time-consuming and tedious process. I currently do this on a daily basis and believe me, it has become a lifestyle and the money that comes with it (on a single file) is not even worth it. I can't put a price tag on the amount of effort that is being put in every case. My only consolation is knowing that I was able to assist a family in keeping their home through a reasonable loan modification.
I feel sorry for the widow from Agoura, CA. The husband need not die. That's just one story we have heard today. Wells Fargo is beyond despicable. Negotiating with them is not for the faint hearted. Just a little over 2 weeks ago, a Wells Fargo rep "initially" approve my client to stop foreclosure proceedings in exchange for an "initial" down payment and better hurry, cuz the "offer" is good for today only. I asked for time to consult with client and was nice enough to give me until the next morning. When I called back exactly the time agreed. Guess what? They couldn't "find" my authorization. Was I shocked to hear their incompetence and inconsistence? Of course not. I have learned to play these lenders games already. But for a homeowner, who's nervous, confused, harassed and intimidated, this is too much. I have realized that a homeowner in distress loses strength in the midst of a simple conversation with a rude, moronic $12.00/hour clerk (or should I say..."negotiator/specialist) on the other end of the line. That Wells Fargo clerk who caused this tragic event to happen to this family has blood on his/her hands.
I am sure there are more cases of this nature. So far, I have to deal with client/homeowners who pass their stresses to me. These people do not know what to do. I am blessed with over 20 years of real estate experience (as a neutral closing agent) and working now with an attorney who has a passion towards helping homeowners. We can only do so much but if these bills are passed, what more can we do. As more homes are getting foreclosed, what has the government accomplished?
Sorry for this long blog. I could go on and on but I guess I am just a small voice out there. YOU GO, MANDELMAN!!!! KEEP ON BRINGING IT ON!!!!
Be safe and well,
modarna
Thank you so much, I can't even tell you. First of all... send me anything you have on banks and their "today only" offers, and anything you have on the "loan mod fees" they're charging. Seriously. Don't give up...
Secondly:
Lee Wasser, props his feet on an adjacent desk chair as he waits on hold for more than 20 minutes to speak with GMAC Mortgage.
His clients, Dean and Nancy Piercy, owe $380,000 on the loan for their home in Shasta Lake, Calif. A logger, Mr. Piercy has lost work hours, making it hard for them keep up with their $2,048 monthly payment — soon set to rise.
Mr. Wasser has already negotiated a solution: GMAC will accept only $270,000 in repayment, allowing the couple to get a fixed rate mortgage from another bank.
But that suddenly is in disarray. The Piercys have been making their payments, but GMAC has been putting their checks aside, holding the money as “loss mitigation fees,” until their application is completed. It has notified credit bureaus that their loan is more than 90 days delinquent, which has lowered their credit score, disqualifying them for the next mortgage.
Mr. Wasser reaches GMAC’s loss mitigation department. He asks for the delinquency to be removed from their status. But that must be handled by a different department: customer service. He is transferred there, where Jessica picks up the call.
“We are not going to amend,” she says, after a strained back and forth. If Mr. Wasser wants it otherwise, he will have to talk to loss mitigation.
“I just talked to them five minutes ago,” he tells Jessica.
“No, you didn’t.” Jessica replies.
“Are you accusing me of lying?” he asks.
Mr. Wasser asks for Jessica’s employee identification number, but the line goes dead. Jessica has apparently hung up.
And that was just one of the situations witnessed and written about by Peter Goodman of The New York Times about a week ago. Here's the link.
[url]http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/29/business/29loanmod.html?_r=1&scp=6&sq=peter%20goodman&st=cse
If you and anyone else cares at all, send this story to every politician you can think of. Send it now.[/url]
If you are trying for a loan mod you MUST HIRE A ATTORNEY! PERIOD! or you will be wasting valuable time.
I use to work at one of the big banks, and I can tell you ALL OF US who worked there were instructed that if ever contacted by a law firm, the call was to directed to a different department.
Legal talks to legal. Its that simple. Banks don't need some massive lawsuit from a law firm, they have no fear of the "unrepresented" homeowner who has no clue about the game.
I was helping my mom with a loan mod and got 1 month of run around. Then I said mom, "time to hire a attorney." Interesting enough the paperwork given to us from the Law Firm, who is experienced in loan modifications, was DIFFERENT than the paper work given to us by the lender. Not by much, but is was CODED differently! Meaning, to me, that the bank/lender would know if the loan mod came from a regular homeowner or a law firm. Even the number to fax the papework to was different in the last four numbers.
The loan mod, which we were told by the lended could NEVER BE DONE BY THIS LENDER, has now been DONE!!! Case closed.
Mortgagemess... Could you please get in touch with me? I need this story. mandelman@mac.com. It's important and I won't reveal you identity if you'd prefer. Seriously... Mandelman
We in the industry get the blame for the entire demise of the world economy. A couple of bad apples do not compare to the Wall Street and Bank Greed and Consumer greed of the past few years but we still get the blame.
LAWYERS are only good when they stop breathing. There are MORE than a couple of bad apple lawyers. The entire industry of lawyers suck and you guys rip EVERYONE off. You run around like dogs chasing not your tail but your own pocke to stick your hand into.
Gimme a break. The bank isn't going to do any worse to us without you than you are going to do to us with you.
Oh...and please don't give me the c**p that you know more than us. LOL! You guys are dumb. You passed the bar? So what. I passed the CPA exam. I bet I'm more qualified to represent the borrower than you.
KUUNER...
Okay, I'm a little confused by your response. I am NOT an attorney, and am not at all sure where you got that impression. Lord, please don't tell me it's from my writing style, because if I've started to write like a lawyer, I'm not sure I want to go on. Just thinking that and my breathing has slowed down... insomuch as I whereas heretofor.... aarrrggghhhhhh.... (thump, crash).
I help people all the time with loan modifications. I am a certified mortgage planning specialist. As such, I understand the aspects of a good and bad mortgage and I understand the motivation of the Banks in "helping" the homeowner. LOL! They (Banks) have no motivation...
What I don't understand is how there are so many Lawyers who are now "loan modification" experts. When exactly did they start working in the Mortgage Business?
Notwithstanding, the best way to approach a loan modification is to get the bank to breach their fiduciary responsibilities.
Once again, Nice Work, Mandelman!!!!
Thanks Doc... By the way, I'm learning about the pooling agreements and using bankruptcy as a tool... stick around... this has only just begin to get interesting... Mandelman
ANY ex broker charging twice (once for the initial c**p loan and a second time to make it an un-c**p loan) is a scammer in my book.
MATTFOLEY...
Okay, fair enough... but brokers can only sell what the banks are offering, right? Plus, brokers are not held to the same standards as are federally chartered commercial banks.
And as far as who made the money as a result of the loans you speak of... I think you'll find that not only did the bankers make zillions more than any broker ever dreamed of by lowering their reserves in 07, but in addition, I don't recall any TARP or FDIC funds going to bail out brokers, do you?
As to the charging of fees... nothing is free... nothing. Obama's plan offers banks money for modifying mortgages AND the banks, including Chase, Wamu, and the rest, are charging homeowners "loan modification fees" of $500-$3,000... I have the paperwork to prove it, and you'll be reading about it soon.
It's the banks, man... it's the banks. You can direct your anger at your broker, you can direct it at "irresponsible homeowners," but it won't change the fact that it's the banks that have bankrupted our economy and it's the banks that stand in our way to recovery. Until we break their hold on our government, we will continue our slide toward depression.
Sorry, but that's just the truth of the matter.
At the end of the day - Joe Homeowner needs to rely on some of their own good prudence and research who they are looking at doing business with.
My motto in the Loan Mod World? Value before profit and only profit from value! Period.
Chris Brown [aka The Implementer]
Hey Chris... I think it's safe to say that I, and every other reasonable and rational person on the planet would agree with your motto. But, if the government would simply regulate the field, wouldn't the market sort that out pretty darn quick. Sub-standard operators in every industry are identified and go by the wayside. I might take my car to a lousy mechanic, but I guarantee you that the mechanic in question won't be around long. Just a thought...
You might find it interesting that there were roughly 110,000 securities scams reported last year, but no one is telling me not to pay my financial advisor, or attempting to shut the industry down. I wonder why... hmm...
Something to ponder...
[b]Hey MIZZVHT...
It is all of those things... but check this out. It's from an article in Bloomberg about loan mods being reported to credit bureaus and causing people's credit scores to drop by 200 points...
Consumers should be wary of signing a waiver of rights? Consumers? That doesn't sound like something a consumer might want to have an attorney weigh in on? Apparently, not to Mr. Zigas. Here's his next line:
Yeah, 'cause that's always who I go to when I wary of signing a waiver of my rights... a nonprofit housing counselor. As a matter of fact, that's what my parents always taught me when I was a boy. They said, "son, anytime someone asks you to sign a waiver of your rights, before you do, make sure you find yourself a good nonprofit housing counselor... and if possible try to get yourself a Jewish nonprofit housing counselor."
This guy Zigas is a clown. Here's the last of his quote from the article:
Would someone mind finding Zigas for me? Get me a phone number, an address... email... anything? This guy needs to wake up in the morning with a horses head lying next to him, but in lieu of that, perhaps I could just write him a letter, or two... or maybe one a day for six or seven years. I'm not proud... or tired.
Seriously... help find Zigas... and win fabulous cash and prizes...
Well, Casi... Because I see a big difference between regular people and professionals. Regular people make bad decisions that harm their lives, professionals make calculated decisions that harm hundreds of millions or even billions of people in this country and around the world. Regular people want a house and some creature comforts based on what the professionals say is okay. Professionals want to make billions of dollars and are willing to lie, cheat and steal to achieve their goals.
The banks knew the cash flows they were sending to Wall St. banks were sub-standard. They knew that the underwriting standards had been abandoned, because they bought the sub-prime lenders and approved of their practices. The Wall St. bankers knew too, yet they used these cash flows to construct bonds that they knew would be improperly rated and sold them to investors around the world. Then they lowered their reserves for losses in order to have billions drop to the bottom line and hundreds of millions paid out in bonuses.
One group of people made some bad decisions in hindsight, the other committed criminal fraud on a scale never before contemplated.
As to Realtors and mortgage brokers... well, they made a bunch in commissions, but I'm pretty sure they've broken even by now, aren't you?
I'm not trying to be a jerk in this, and I do agree with you that there are many at fault to varying degree... but I don't think it's unfair to assess the situation in terms of who did what to whom and come up with one group more guilty than the rest. And it's the banks... no question about it.
Then let's talk bailouts. How much did the homeowners, the brokers and the realtors get in bailout funds? Let's see... carry the 3... oh yeah... none. And the banks... well, I'm going to need a calculator that goes into the trillions.
Thank you Carrierpigeon... I appreciate you saying so and I hope to see you around more often. I plan to write more of the same and I need someone who sees things clearly as you obviously do. The only way the banks are being shortchanged, is.... wait, there is no way the banks are being short changed... over changed, maybe.